3 new tyres: MICHELIN ENERGY SAVER in 195/65 R15 91T

[jorgy]

Hello

Just in case somebody was on the look for tyres, I thought I'd let you know I have these 3 of these tyres for sale (buy as many as u need):

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... CA:GB:1123

MICHELIN ENERGY SAVER in 195/65 R15 91T

As written, they are T rated, so good for 118mph top speed. They are the exact specified dimension for a 2.1td, both S1 and S2, manual and auto, and conform speed-rating wise (top speed: manual: 119mph, auto S1: 118, auto S2: 117).

They'd be also good for a 115hp S1 naturaly aspirated 2lt, although a step wider and larger in diameter than the manufacturer spec (185/65 15).

195/65 15 is the dimension worn by 135hp S2 2lts, but sadly these would nominally need H-rated tyres (as S1 2lts, top speed 127mph).

Have just fitted 4 of them to my 2.1td and I'm well impressed with how silent they are compared to the Kumhos I have on the V6. One thing I noticed is their sides are very soft -softest I've ever seen on a tyre, you can literally bend the profile wall by hand-.

Note that these are not your usual "Eco" tyre with crappy grip. I'd never have bought such a tyre. I decided to go for them after reading a comparative tyre handling test -a mix of tyres, not eco-tyre focused- where they scored brilliantly (best in the dry; fastest track lap).

On top of that, they were measured to consume 806 Watt to rotate (test's lowest), when the worst tyre of the lot needed 1.245 Watt. With 4 tyres on your car, that's almost 1.8kw gained!

I'm glad to cut 10% off the stated ebay price if they are to shoe an XM!!

cheers
G

[robert_e_smart]

Interesting to have an opinion on these tyres George.

I have bought a set of the same, but 205/65/R15s. They were brand new and were on a showroom car (the new owner wanted bigger wheels on the car). But I haven't used them yet, as I am running on winter tyres at the moment.

I hope they're good, I have the older type of energies on my 2.0 Si, and I think they're good. the 2.1 had Primacies, but they were old, so past their best, so not really fair of me to comment on them (but I didn't like them, grip was poor).

Robert

[XMX]

Interesting to have an opinion on these tyres George.
I have bought a set of the same, but 205/65/R15s. They were brand new and were on a showroom car (the new owner wanted bigger wheels on the car). But I haven't used them yet, as I am running on winter tyres at the moment.

Hi Robert,
I take that these are for your new acquisition (the 2.5 TD) ? Make sure your using 'V' rated tyre's for that anything lower i.e. 'H' rated tyre's would possibly squeal when cornering even with a fairly sedate driving mode (from the fronts anyway) also in the Citroen Owners Handbook/Technical spec. recommends that its 'V' rated also they could be an insurance issue running your vehicle on the incorrect specified tyre's (i.e. not standard to factory O/E ).

Hi George,

MICHELIN ENERGY SAVER in 195/65 R15 91T
As written, they are T rated, so good for 118mph top speed. They are the exact specified dimension for a 2.1td, both S1 and S2, manual and auto, and conform speed-rating wise (top speed: manual: 119mph, auto S1: 118, auto S2: 117).

That's NOT quite correct !
In the Citroen Owners Handbook/Technical spec. for the S2 models it states:-
For both Saloons/Estates 2.1 Turbo Diesels MANUAL gearbox - 195/65 R15 91H (So that's a 'H' rated tyre up 130 mph).
and for the Saloon/Estates 2.1 Turbo Diesel with an AUTO-box -205/65 R15 94V (So that's a 'V' rated tyre up 149 MPH).
Its only the non Turbo 2.1 Diesels that can use a 195/65 R15 91T tyre (As 'T' rated only good for up 118 MPH as stated) but I've only ever seen an S1 on a 'G' plate a very long time ago so I don't why its in the S2 owners handbook unless its just to cover them if someone had an SI and needed to refer to it, AFAIK they never made any S2 NON-Turbo 2.1's for the UK market.

Just to be 100% sure check with the S1 owners Handbook if you have one, I may have one and will take a look later unless Robert or someone else has one handy to check that out ?
Sorry if this is bad news (That's if there the wrong rating for a S1) as you said you just fitted them to your 2.1 TD !

XMX

[hobblerian]

My local tyre place supplies Michelin Energy Saver 195/65/H15 fitted and balanced for £54.90, so your offer is not such a bargain i'm affraid.

[robert_e_smart]

Hi XMX,

I bought them for the 2.1 TD Auto, but since its on the winter tyres, I put the other tyres which were on my alloy rims onto the 2.5, as the tyres it had on it were rubbish. I've no idea what the speed rating on them is though. But I don't pay much attention to that considering that I rearely go over 80.

I don't have a series 1 handbook to hand at the moment, but I can look when I get home.

I think I have 195/65/R15s on the 2.0 Si, or something very close to that.

Robert

[jorgy]

Hi all, and thanks for your interest,

XMX, no worries, I consciously fitted T-rated tyres to my 2.1td, going by the car's top speed and by my average use pattern, and not by what Cit specifies (H-rated for S1). It was not my intention to force anyone to fit these to their XM. I suggested possible fits looking at top speed and tyre dimension, not speed ratings per se, my fault I admit. I used this kind of table, where speed-rating is not specified -thanks for putting thins straight- :





I fully understand that fitting an H-rated tyre would have the manufacturer covered in all possible events, however the manual 2.1td, with a Citroen-claimed top speed of 119.3mph, really does not need H-rated tyres (for 130mph) unless you'd like to be doing circles at the car's top speed in a test track. Jocking apart, if I lived e.g. in Germany, where you can regularly travel at high speeds for sustained time periods, I'd fit the H-rated ones, if not anything else it'd ware the tyres less. Or, if I lived in Greece, where you can do the same high-speed driving, also in very twisty (bendy) field, and in summertime tarmac boiling at 70C and the occassional bad road really stress tyres to their limits, I'd fit H-rated ones. For the UK conditions though, I think not only the T-rated are theoretically sufficient, but in real life will be working nearer to their optimal operating temperature at any given moment, thus performing better.

The load index (91) actuall covers any XM application, even V6s, while e.g. the non-turbo 2lts require 87 according to my S1 manual, and is the correct spec for the 2.1td. I've been absolutely wrong though in that, s I see in the image posted above, S2 Estates Automatics are specifically equipped with 205/65 15 instead of 195/65 15thus the 195 tyre is playing down safety. On my car, I've not had any squealing yet, but will keep you up to date with this as I drive the car faster and faster. Personally I spend 90% of my time going straight on a motorway, being bored at 60 or 70mph -I'm glad when I travel out of peak-times and can sustain 80mph.

A long discussion anyway, but in terms of being legal one shouldn't fit the T-rated tyres to their XM -unless it's for your spare wheel, or if you drive a non-turbo diesel-.

Hobblerian, thanks for that info, sounds very cheap; I based my pricing on mytyres.co.uk, on ebay, on tyre-shoper.co.uk, and on Kwickfit, and all this is more expensive than my price, even if you take into account they include fitting.

Robert, I'll write more on how these tyres behave when I press more on them; for now, another noticeable difference with the V6 is that the 2.1td looks significantly more eager to change direction, feels lighter. Prob this is due to the weight difference though and not the tyres.

cheers
G

[jorgy]

Here are the tyres specs from the S1 driver's manual (column next to "Injection" is the "V6"):

[xmexclusive]

Hi All

In my experience provided you are not impeeded by traffic all types of rear tyres squeal when you take a 2.5 round a tight roundabout.
Mind you the 2.5 estate that arrived shod with 195/60's was particularly noisey. They did not stay on long.

John

[jorgy]

Hi
Just to say I've reduced price to £44 per tyre, that's £49/tyre at your door if 2 or 3 were bought.
thanks
George