Looking for a 2.1td WITH ECU (not mech inj) hatch + manual

[jorgy]

As per title, my plans to sort out my V6 have come to a sudden stop as my indie is going out of business, so it's getting SORN'd, and I'm looking for another roadworthy XM.

After having tasted the Bosch mechanically-pumped 2.1td, I'm curious to try an ECU'd one (that would make it Lucas pump if I'm right). I know the risks of Lucas (in-built design fault?), I don't like the S2 looks much, still I want to try one.

Anybody would considering selling theirs to me?

I'm looking at Xantias HDi's also as a stop gap -curious to try the HDi- and would decide on one in the next 2 weeks, but if someone thinks he could get an ECU'd 2.1td XM in my hands sooner or later (bef/aft Christmas), I'd stop looking and follow that lead instead.

Please get in touch here or by email as my PM doesn't work properly.

Thanks
George

[Peter.N.]

Hi George

You need one post January '96 for ECU control, not many about. They give a couple more miles per gallon but can go wrong and are expensive to fix, the mechanical ones on the other hand seem to last forever, I have one with about 270k on it. The early Xantia Hid's seem quite reliable, contrary to my expectations, and are brilliant on fuel, 20% better than the 2.1 which in itself is better than the 1.9.

Peter

[messerschmitt owner]

Hi George

You need one post January '96 for ECU control, not many about. They give a couple more miles per gallon but can go wrong and are expensive to fix, the mechanical ones on the other hand seem to last forever, I have one with about 270k on it. The early Xantia Hid's seem quite reliable, contrary to my expectations, and are brilliant on fuel, 20% better than the 2.1 which in itself is better than the 1.9.

Peter

I think there's mine, but it isn't for sale at the moment! And Jorgy has already asked. Mine is developing small issues at the moment - driver's window cable broke, no fan control - now that is a pain on icy mornings ...

I can't say the fuel consumption is better on the ECU'd Lucas car over the mechanical Bosch one - on a run yes, but on my daily up hill down dale commute the white car is 3-4mpg better.

Campbell

[jorgy]

Thanks guys -I'm very happy with the performance of my mechanical one, so can only think the ecu'd one would be even better in general. And of course I'd accept the risk of a big break-down of the Lucas, but fingers crossed...As I've said elsewhere, I *wish* I could fit a Xantia HDi in an XM...I'm sure the Xantia is a very good car, it probably is a "bettered XM" in many ways, but the looks just don't do it for me...too neutered. And I love the ample space in an XM...

I was contemplating this very promising green 2.1td on ebay, but sadly it's presenting an airlock and starves of fuel when running (the seller tells me), otherwise I'd get it and bring it back like my "Poole" one! They are like twins with mine too!

Campbell, sure there must be a fault with the Lucas one? Under no circumstances I'd expect it to use more fuel than the mechanical one? Even more, by 3-4mpg!? Yours r both S2s too (=same weight; S1s are lighter). Although the ecu'd one makes 1kg of torque more than the mechanical (about 25 instead of about 24kg)? Maybe they've "turned" the fuelling up on these ones? U'd need however to be *using* this extra fuel to score a lower mpg...?

Hmmm let's see if anybody else has a Lucas one-too-many....

cheers
G

[robert_e_smart]

Hi George,

That 2000 2.1 TD Auto I have was quite nice on Lucas. It was a bit quicker off the mark than my other Bosch TD Auto. I didn't have it on Lucas long enough to compare on fuel economy. But the Bosch pump I have fitted to it now had the fueling increased by its previous owner, and the car is as quick as it was on lucas, and quicker than my other Bosch 2.1 TD.

The lucas gets you cruise control, on board fuel consumption like on injected petrols and 2.5s. But comparing it to a TD Bosch its a lot more complicated, and there is more to go wrong.

Compare this:




to this:

[Dieselman]

Jorgy, You are confusing the Epic system with a fully electronic controlled common rail HDi. The epic simply uses electronics to control the mechanical pump. It controls minimum and maximum speed and the volume of fuelling by operating the mechanical metering valve instead of a cable from the accelerator pedal.

[Peter.N.]

There are two on ebay at the moment, both silly prices though.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1997-CITROEN-XM-V ... 2eb141e742

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1997-R-Reg-Citroe ... 0454226242?
pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item1e5fad8542

Peter

[jorgy]

Thanks all.

Dieselman, no no, I do understand the basic differences between Bosch-IDI/Epic-IDI/HDI. One thing I don't know: other than the parameters u mention, does the Lucas adjust the fueling timing electronically too (along with fuel quantity metering)?

Yep those on ebay are silly prices, and they are automatic!

The other thing I just found out is that Xantias HDis are dearer to insure than a td XM...

cheers
G

[Dieselman]

One thing I don't know: other than the parameters u mention, does the Lucas adjust the fueling timing electronically too (along with fuel quantity metering)?

The timing will have an electro-hydraulic actuator just like the Bosch mechanical pump, but with a needle lift sensor. The fuel metering is mechanical with electronic control.
This is a mechanical pump with electric control, not a full electronic system.

[robertmnorton]

Hi George,here is the promotional brochure for the EPIC,as an insight.Once again bear in mind there are many unsubstanciated comments on Lucas reliability,particularly in reference to it's PSA fitments.
robertm