Dashboard and Lights

[Dieselman]

I would need your steps to be listed in order to check throughly, but it sounds like you may have disconnected the dim-dip function, which was probably shutting the HID ballasts down, due to lack of current to keep them operating.
Power backfeeding from the HID balasts into the dim-dip circuit would keep the sidelights illuminated.

[newxmman]

Mmm. I’ll do it from the start, not sure you’re right DM. 3 years ago installed Ballasts with a live feed, all done correctly and worked for 2 years. Out of nowhere, things went bang as I was driving along the road. Sidelights Came on and stayed on. Another couple of fuses blew inc. I think Blower and F10 I think blew at that time but I didn’t have a door opening warning noise before I put the new fuse in, so maybe it blew a while before, is that possible though and all still working? Anyhow the lights stayed as they were after it all went bang, I couldn’t get dip, I could get full beam, sidelights on permanently. F10 must have gone again cos door open warning noise stopped. Can’t remember exactly what F10 controls. Then came to yesterday when you know what happened. Why things started to work when we installed F10 and jiggled about with the fuse box relays I don’t know. The Headlamp relay may have started the whole blowing, I don’t know at all, but the relay plug in isn’t quite right is it, not only that but why did I have to bend a pin back to make the dip work and why does the five pin relay work on 4 pins. I don’t get it. Any questions for clarification?

[Dieselman]

The fifth leg of the realy socket must be connected to something, otherwise either 4 or 5 leg relay would function the same...assuming the correct reay type is installed.

With your information we are just guessing, we need detailed information of which connections have what power, at what time.
The circuit diagrams will give the information needed to trace exactly what is happening.

S1 wiring diagrams thread.
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=10268

[newxmman]

Oh dear DM I don’t know where to start, we started by following your guide and found what we found and now it works. The live feed for the ballast kit comes straight from the battery and is grounded to the car. We never touched anything else! The 5 pin relay is correct but the female is faulty I’m sure but it works with four pins where it flickers and goes out on 5??? Maybe it turns off the dip when main beam comes on whereas now dip and main beam are on together?..

[Dieselman]

Oh dear DM

I don't think I can help you any further.

I think you should enlist the services of an auto electrician to perform your modification. I suspect they won't wire in the HID ballasts as it is illegal to install HID lights into Halogen type lamp units.
Noting the fact you have increased the fuse rating to stop it blowing, I think if you carry on, you are running the risk of an electrical fire.
It appears your wiring is incorrect, but due to lack of proper technical feedback I cannot say where you have gone wrong.

F10 had blown but it’s done that before. I re seated the door open warning relay and replaced F10 with a higher amp.

[newxmman]

Hi DM. You have helped me a lot already. But I think we may have crossed wires if you pardon the pun! I agree with you that it is dodgy putting in a higher than recommended fuse, it’s only just higher and of course I don’t know for sure why it started to blow. I know that the warning door open hasn’t always worked even when the lights were ok, what did you say the F10 fuse was for? The ballasts has nothing to do with the side lights staying on as the ballasts were not even connected after the fuses blew. It had to be happening at the fuse relay box inside the car cos that’s where the fault corrected itself when we took it out and reseated the relays inc the door warning relay. The receptor for the headlamp relay must be faulty to do what it did to the Five pin relay, why it works with only four pins I have no idea but it does. The lights and everything else when we first did it, wasn’t a problem so it can’t be that that has caused the headlamp relay receptor to behave in this way. There was a fault at that receptor which stopped the dips coming on. There was a fault in the fuse relay box inside the car but I doubt if the two are connected. Now my live feed comes straight from the battery to work my dips and it is successful, there is nothing wrong with my wiring there, it is very straight forward to install and find a ground. I agree something has gone wrong and I don’t know if it will show up again and I probably will now re install a fuse in f10 of the correct ampage. Other than that it looks as though we found the problem and it now works. I am wondering if the open door warning relay is also faulty cos when we were playing around with that and re installing, the sidelight fault corrected itself. Could that relay be responsible for blowing f10? We also checked the two other fuses you talked about and they were ok. I’m not technical but I’m trying to describe for you the way the car behaved, it’s still a bit of a mystery but you helped us narrow it down. I should now get an mot. Then I’ll look again at it. Thanks for your help as always.

[newxmman]

By the way, DM. The legality is far from certain, it’s so grey it could have fallen from the sky. No way of ascertaining a ‘housing’.

[Dieselman]

By the way, DM. The legality is far from certain, it’s so grey it could have fallen from the sky. No way of ascertaining a ‘housing’.

Other than if the reflector unit isn't marked for Xenon, it's iilegal to fit a Xenon HID burner.

Anyone installing an HID kit into a halogen reflector is breaking the law, as is anyone selling them for road use.

No grey area.

"Existing halogen headlamp units on vehicles first used on or after 1 April 1986 must not be converted to be used with high intensity discharge (HID) or light emitting diode (LED) bulbs. If such a conversion has been done, you must fail the headlamp for light source and lamp not compatible.

This does not refer to complete replacement headlamp units which may be constructed with HID or LED light sources.

If a complete headlamp unit has been replaced with a unit that was manufactured with HID or LED light sources, it must not be failed for ‘Light source and lamp not compatible’ but it must meet all other requirements detailed in section 4 of this manual specific to the type fitted at the time of test.

You can identify HID headlamps from:

‘DCR’ mark on the headlamp lens or body
an igniter module or inverter behind the headlamp
taking a few seconds to reach full intensity
a bluish tinge to the light

HID headlamps use high voltage. You should take care when inspecting these headlamps."

With HID lights, you also need a working headlamp leveling system, which you do have and a cleaning system, which you don't have, to pass the MOT test.

You aren't going to obtain a legal MOT pass with the HID kit fitted, so might as well remove it completely, at which point I think your electrical problems will be resolved.
I suspect the trigger wire for the HID kit is wired to an incorrect point, probably before the headlamp relay, which is causing back-feeding of power into the lighting circuit, hence the sidelights staying on, etc.
This is probably what is also causing the additional current drain, hence the blowing of F10.

Your insurance company also need to know of your modification, at which point they will probably decline cover and, if caught, the Police may prossecute you for using a vehicle with dazzle-master headlights, that contravene the construction and use regulations.

[newxmman]

Flipping heck! Wish someone had told me all that before, perhaps even the retailers online selling them all! Well I think it’s so complicated even for an mot er. Can’t see them going that deep??? Well anyway. The wiring is simple just for your knowledge. It goes live from battery, ground to the side of the car, to a relay. That the supplies the wiring for the near side and the wiring across the car for the offside. There is of course a ballast on either side giving power to each lamp. I have a fuse from the battery to relay. I had not expected power to surge up the lighting wiring if I’m honest. Still I suppose the f10 fuse did it’s job if that’s the case. I still can’t understand why it came right after I’d re sat the relays under the dash before I’d installed the new light set. And I still can’t understand why it blew mid driving in broad daylight with no lights being used and after 2 years. If it is that you suggest causing the problem then why did it take so long? Also I still suspect the faulty headlamp relay receptor which was noisy and not accepting five pins. It is still a brain bender! I do understand that the five pins are not always necessary, sometimes, depending. Thanks again DM.

[newxmman]

This is interesting DM. I’ve had a dig and you re right technically re illegal bulbs. Seems it happened at Brexit…after market hid kits can’t have an ‘E’ on them so they would fail. Then I saw a far more direct mot direction. Basically if a car has been converted with a kit, they must fail it. That’s of course if they look that deep, often they don’t, if the lamp works at the correct level, which it will on an XM and it doesn’t dazzle, more than likely it will pass. Yes, you could be prosecuted and so could the mot er but as there are no government inspections, this is unlikely. Police may know the law, if they check, they probably won’t. The new regulations don’t mention after market bulbs anywhere else on the car…why? The law is outdated and should be changed with new protections against road problems. No one has been prosecuted including retailers who still sell them. The laugh is that I put mine in before 2021 Brexit! So now what will I use instead of the ridiculously dim dipped lights on an XM…any suggestions…now they could cause an accident!