Citroen XM Forum

I fear this may provoke howls of indignation, but equally feel this is something I must address.

Having owned one several years ago that I eventually had to sell 'cause I couldn't afford to keep taking it back to be fixed every few weeks, I've nevertheless got the bug again and over the past few months have been scouring the classifieds for another XM saloon to replace my 2001 Xsara HDI Turbo Estate as a daily driver.

Without exception, they've all had faults, sometimes numerous and serious, and this has prompted frequent recourse to the Forum to try and determine remedies, causes and likely severity. This in turn has prompted the realisation that only if one is a (very) competent mechanic with a (good) knowledge of these wonderful but woefully complicated and flawed cars, is ownership an option unless of course, one is wealthy enough to employ an apparently rare, specialist mechanic on a regular basis. None of which applies to me. (However I can manage simple stuff and as owner of an even rarer and delicate Lancia Gamma Coupe I can at least fathom how the basics work and why faults develop, wheras the XM's suspension and electrics usually defy my attempts, and possibly, logic).

A recent trawl through the Forum's back pages suggests that there are less than a 1000 XMs in roadworthy condition left, and with several of those I've looked at being sold with the rather pathetic explanation that they'll otherwise be scrapped, numbers are likely to diminish faster and further in the coming year.

My overarching question then is this: is it possible for someone like me to regard an XM as a daily driver? And if the answer's 'yes', does anyone know a competent and reasonably priced garage who can maintain one within a 20-25 miles radius of Knighton/Presteigne on the Herefordshire-Powys border? And if the answer to both questions is 'No', how would I fare with a decent BX ?

Sorry to be so long-winded, but I am genuinely keen to own an XM, but genuinely dismayed by the level of complexity articulated by the super-knowledgeable enthusiasts who seem almost to relish the car's failings and failures on this Forum.

Hi Markysimon

Sorry but only you can decide on an XM as a daily driver.
I have chosen that option but it is one of my retirement interests.
My usage is seldom critical and can be spread over a few roadworthy cars.
If the chosen one throws a fit there is usually another ready and waiting.
If I need a part there is usually one to find or rob from another car.
That is very different from your intended usage.
Paul in North Wales might just be close enough to provide the support you look for XM or BX or other Cit/Pug.
For XM's car selection is now a real can of worms.
The last knocking of the working XM's throw up many interesting "features" and problems.
Many existing owners really want their XM to survive because they still like it so much.
But then they have decided the car is already a lost cause for them.
Current prices are incredibly cheap whatever the condition.
For you selecting the right condition one is absolutely critical.
Not an easy task for you or even one of us to help you with.
For me overall condition matters little as I just see a collection of spares that gives the value to me of that XM.
At scrap price if it happens to MOT and I can drive the spares for a while to check their condition so much the better.
Occasionally one turns out so good it goes SORN/dry store as a long life car.
That tells you that even after buying 20+ XM's over 10 years I cannot be totally sure how good one is on purchase inspection.
Enjoy the search but take your time and use it to make absolutely sure that you really want an XM.

John

I will say firstly that even the newest of xm's is 11 years old now which is dog age, the oldest are goind to be 22 which is ropey old dog age.
Having said that the XM is a rather reliable car, the core mechanical parts are usualy bomb proof, and old derv will usualy suffer air ingress intot he fuel lines which causes all sorts of meladies but for the price of a filter canister and some fuel hose is easily sorted, petrols are again usualy bomb proof but older ones may be getting fragile management looms.

something of this age will have to be tweeked and fettled at reasonably regular intervals to keep it reliable, mine for instance is 19years old and i could and have used it as a daily driver with no reliability issues, but there is always something that needs doing, be t a dying engine mount a ball joint, or height corrector lubing.

In short if you want a day to day hack you wont really beat what you have already, but since you own a Gamma i can only assume you are in fact totaly nuts..................all you need to do now is find your XM

welcome to the forum

D

I use the Xm as a daily driver, but have a cx to fill in the gaps when the xm is out of use, so far thats been since about february.
So not bad really, the answer is of course to buy a Cx.

Practicality was only the second of my reasons for buying an XM, the first being ride comfort. I have been driving them almost exclusivly for the last 15 years and a more practical car you will not find. My estates have carried arm chairs, settees, building supplies, engines and a large quantity of TVs when I was working, a bigger estate I don't think you will find, that combined with superb comfort and over 50 mpg form the 2.1 manual and I think its unbeatable - but, unless you have a reasonable ammount of spare cash they are not a car to own unless you can repair them yourself and I think most XM owners can, in fact another great feature is that you can repair them yourself.

I am now doing most of my mileage in an Hdi 406 not because I have fallen out with my XMs but because of the present price of fuel, I still have two on the road and intend keeping them so.

Peter

The problems with XM's are not car specific usually, but more "old car" problems combined with previous owner neglect. Once they are sorted the problems don't come back.

Being biased, I think the Xm makes a fantastic daily car.

I would rather buy a good Xm for the money, than a C5 of the same price for example.

I for one use my Xm as a daily drive and it is very reliable with only minor niggles and i have a citroen mechanic who looks after it when anything needs doing i would hate to think what i would do without it.

Regards,
Norman

Well thanks to all of you who've so quickly and comprehensively responded to my hand-wringing query, which in turn prompts a few more questions and observations:

To Dean I would say yes, Gamma ownership is akin to madness. There are only about 20 Coupes left on the road in the UK and without the Gamma Forum maintenance would be impossible. But it is a much simpler car and easier to work on, even by me in the case of things like brakes, electrics etc. I use mine throughout the spring and summer, though not as a daily driver.

To John I would ask, who is 'Paul' in North Wales? (N.B. I took my first XM to John Price at the Forge Garage at Lydham near Bishop's Castle who had some experience of and sympathy for older Citruins. But John himself was getting on a bit and his underlings weren't so fussy or knowledgeable... and getting to and from his garage was a real pain).

Otherwise I cannot but agree that XMs are fine cars when they're working (as I in fact said, and know from earlier experience), but I know two people (JamieB of this parish being one of them) who do use them as daily drivers without having a stable of 'spare' cars they can rely on when things go wrong - which seems to be the caveat that most of you feel is necessary condition of ownership. I'm now wondering if the solution is throwing £2-3,000 at Wolesley House or Savoy for one that has (apparently) been fettled to optimum running condition? What are the Forum's views on that?

Finally, the green 16v SX I saw in Belper on Tuesday at least had a strong engine, good tyres, interior and exhaust, but I was put of by a rusty strut top, sticking sunroof and slow hydraulics: in the Forum's view, how critical and expensive would those things be to fix?

Many thanks again for your interest and no, I haven't been put off!

Mark

Hi Mark

Paul goes by the user name Citroenxm on here and fettles PSA cars in his spare time.
For example he recently mentioned being able to supply and fit a refurbished strut head for £150.
Of the specialist XM suppliers you mentioned both are worth a look round and chat with if you can visit.
In my opinion for current prices the cars will roadworthy rather than overhauled in every respect.
You can still expect to have to go back and get help with the odd problem.
Savoy is the nearest so it might be best to make him aware of you particular interests first.
He would then look out and suggest for potential cars.

John