2 * 2.1 SD

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Julianw
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Location: Congleton, Cheshire, UK

Re: 2 * 2.1 SD

Post by Julianw » Tue Mar 17, 2026 9:59 pm

Dieselman wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2026 8:24 am
If you have dormant cars, keep the batteries charged, otherwise they will go dead cell, necessitating replacement.
And with the propensity of modernz for parasitic drain, even disconnecting the battery is better than doing nothing. I have a (very useful) Chrysler Grand Voyager that loves to kill its battery over a few weeks of no use. And when the battery starts to get low, the infinite wisdom* of GM design guarantees both to completely kill the battery AND invite all sorts of security issues. How?

By randomly opening and closing the power tailgate, until the battery is dead. Ask me how I know...

Dieselman
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Re: 2 * 2.1 SD

Post by Dieselman » Tue Apr 14, 2026 7:29 am

Being disappointed that the engine still dripped oil when running I am having another go at sealing it. Last year I removed the gearbox and flywheel and installed a new crankshaft oil seal.
Having already fitted a new sump gasket a few years ago I don't think the leak is from there and believe it is the two upright rubber seals on the sides of the No.1 main bearing cap are leaking.
This engine uses a slightly strange arrangement where the No.1 main bearing cap (flywheel end) forms part of the cylinder block, so as well as the usual circular crankshaft seal there are a pair of rubber seals running vertically.
Unfortunately, to successfully remove and re-install the bearing cap means removal of the flywheel, sump and replacing crankshaft oil seal again.

I also noticed an Lhm leak from the return to reservoir pipe.

I've jacked up the front of the car and placed it on axle stands and used my rear suspension blockers to keep the rear of the car raised, for stability and working space.

Home made suspension blocker.
WP_20260413_004.jpg
It's awkward to insert the right side one as the fuel filler pipe is in the way, but it can be fed in. Raise the car to Maximum setting and post the tool in.
It would be easier with the wheel off as the arch liner could be pulled out of the way more.
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They work by jamming the suspension arm in a higher position.
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With both in position the rear of the car rests like:
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Lhm leak at the joint between steel and rubber pipes. First look shows there may be a split in the rubber pipe, just above the Ligarex band.
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Drain engine and gearbox oil, remove the battery, Lhm filter unit and reservoir, the turbo boost transducer, then lift the body to engine wiring connectors out of the holder and unbolt the holder at the rear of the battery tray. This is the third bolt on the battery tray that is awkward to access with the Lhm reservoir in place.
Unbolt the Gnd strap and Lhm pipe retainer bracket from the top of the gearbox.

Remove the turbo to intercooler pipe and to avoid damaging them, the TDC sensor and speedometer drive cable.
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Disconnect the gear linkages by prying the ball joints apart, undo the L shaped retainer bolts holding the Rh driveshaft intermediate bearing, the lower suspension ball joints, driveshaft nuts etc and remove the drivehafts.
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To make space I jam the hub out with a wood prop.
WP_20260413_022.jpg

TBC...
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Dieselman
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Re: 2 * 2.1 SD

Post by Dieselman » Thu Apr 16, 2026 7:00 am

A bit more stripping done.
Jack the engine up slightly and install a support, which is a tube and chain attached to the lifting eye, then allow the engine to settle onto it.
WP_20260415_001.jpg
Unbolt the gearbox mount, which has four bolts mounting it to the chassis rail and three to the gearbox. I chose to remove it as a single piece, but this was rather fiddly, so I may split it down to re install it.
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I unbolted the gearbox from the engine and pushed it over the subframe, which does allow sufficient room to work. I removed the clutch and flywheel bolts and was surprised when oil ran out of some of the flywheel bolt holes. These were dry when tight and there was no evidence of oil on either the front, or back of the flywheel and the crank seal was completely dry before the oil ran out.

At present I assume this was oil trapped in the holes when I replaced the crank-shaft seal, as only the tip of the bolt threads are wet, being dry past the thread lock. I'll ensure these holes are thoroughly flushed out and sealed when re-assembling and check to see if they are actually blind holes, or just appear to be by inserting a probe. Citroen do state to use thread-lock...maybe this is the reason why. I may assume they are fully drilled holes and use thread-lock and sealant when rebuilding.

It's hard to see where the oil leaks from as it only leaks with the engine running and it has to be fully built up before that can happen, as the starter motor bolts to the gearbox.

I believe the leak is the seals in the main bearing cap.
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I removed the sump, which was stuck on very well...the gasket had bonded tightly to both surfaces, showing no signs of leaking.
Note position of any different bolts. There are three Allen headed ones and three shorter ones in the main bearing cap and under the oil breather outlet.
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I packed the engine casing with polyethene and paper to ensure no debris entered it and scraped the gasket off the engine lock with a scraper.
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You can see the ends of the vertical seals in these images.
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91 3.0 sei M. 4852 EXY Black
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Dieselman
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Re: 2 * 2.1 SD

Post by Dieselman » Sat Apr 18, 2026 8:42 am

I removed the No.1 main bearing block and checked if the crank holes, which I can confirm are drilled through, which is why they require sealant on the bolts at assembly.
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No.1 main bearing cap also has a drain hole through it, so no pressure builds up behind the crank seal.

There is a tiny amount of wear, only on one side of the bearing, but still very serviceable. This engine has covered 170,000 miles and some go past 300,000 miles without new bearings. There is no issue with noise or lack of generating oil pressure when cranking.
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The rubber seals are pretty hard, one in particular feels more like cardboard than rubber. I think the dark, dirty colouring, indicates oil has been leaking past the seal.
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I cleaned up the inside of the engine block and as there was originally some solidified sealant in the top corners added some new, only in the corers an across the outer flange.
The bearing cap has champers at the top corners and I wanted to ensure a good seal. the rubber piece does extend into that gap, but the sealant provides surety.
WP_20260417_004.jpg
Hook the new seals on, I then lubricated the seal, inside the block, the crank and the bearing shell, leaving the very upper sections of the housing and rebate dry for the sealant to grip to. When installing the seals you are meant to use very thin metal slider plates to press the rubber seals into the bearing block groove but I couldn't find anything thin enough.
I tried using thin plastic, but even that was too thick, so I wobbled the bearing journal as I inserted it, so the rubber slid on the lubrication and didn't pull downward too much.

Lubricate the cap bolt threads, install and tighten to 15Nm, followed by 60°. I did mark the bolt points, but found the markings difficult to see, so reverted to using an angle gauge.
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The angle tightening wasn't accurate on one bolt so I added another 2°. I then trimmed the rubber seals leaving about 2mm protrusion and will add some sealant when rebuilding. I believe later engines use only sealant and have no rubber seals in this position.
WP_20260417_007.jpg
I then drifted the crank seal into position.
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Dieselman
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Re: 2 * 2.1 SD

Post by Dieselman » Sun Apr 19, 2026 6:49 am

Even though I had installed the crank seal I wasn't completely happy about the main bearing showing some wear and knowing that Big End bearings, especially the upper one, always wear first due to the force of the engine firing, so decided to check some of those.

Crank bearing failure is the most common single reason for engine failure and if it happens the crank is damaged often beyond repair, so repairs become costly.

I also checked the crankshaft end float to see if the thrust bearing is worn. The spec. is 0.12-0.32mm.
The most common reasons for thrust bearing wear are riding the clutch, or starting the engine with the clutch pedal depressed, so avoid both.

Using a dial gauge and levering the crank from end to end gave a measurement of 0.23mm, which is in spec. See attached technical data.
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I then removed No.3 ns No.2 big end cap and both bearing shells. For both sets the lower one has very minor wear, as anticipated the upper one is showing more.

No.3 bearings.
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No.2 bearings.
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The crank journals are in excellent condition, so I will just polish those before installing new the bearing shells I have ordered.
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I removed the oil pump for better access, cleaned it and the gasket material off the sump.
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You can see the crankshaft bearings here, note this is a five main bearing engine which bodes well for durability and smoothness.
WP_20260418_014.jpg
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Re: 2 * 2.1 SD

Post by Dieselman » Tue Apr 28, 2026 7:18 am

Parts arrived and progress continued.

Having removed cylinder 2&3 big end caps and bearings I checked the new standard bearing shells were the correct size, which they were.
At this point I just wanted to be sure the crank hadn't already been machined smaller than the new bearings.
If the crank was smaller the plastigauge wouldn't thin out as much due to excessive clearance. I'll cover this later on.
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Using some nylon pipe, I made up some protectors to slip over the con-rod bolts, to protect the crank journal.
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I then tried to remove the main bearing shells and even with the bearing caps all loose found rolling/pushing the upper shells out was very awkward on some of them, even after relaxing all the main bearing cap bolts and slacking off the alternator and hydraulic pump belts.
I found the best method was to push the un-tabbed end of the shell with a flat screwdriver to get them started, then a plastic trim tool, then by a thin folded aluminium sheet, at which point I could pull the shell out using a plastic trim tool hooked into the oil hole.
Obviously I needed to ensure any implement wasn't going to mark the crank journal.

The main journals all appear in good condition and it's not really possible to polish them in situ, so I installed the new shells by lubricating with assembly lube, rolling in the upper one, un-tabbed end first, pushing with a plastic trim tool until the tab located in the recess and the end of the shell is level/just below the mounting surface .
Note the ones with the hole in are the upper shells, to allow oil into the crankshaft bearings.
I found that rubbing the leading edge of the back of the new upper shell to remove burrs really helped with installation, as otherwise the sharp edge tended to snag when rolling it round the bearing holder. I used some fine W&D paper.
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New main bearing shells. Upper one has oil feed hole. Note locating tabs.
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The two main bearings towards the timing belt end of the engine showed some damage, it appears though some contamination has squeezed into the bearing shells.
I did note the #5 (timing belt end) upper shell appeared to be installed slightly below the tab recess and appeared to have a tiny burr of metal. I wonder if that one wasn't installed carefully enough on initial build and the metal shaving went round the bearing clearance of #5 and #4.
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All the main bearing journals were perfect apart from a slight witness mark on #5 journal, which can't be felt with a finger nail and appears to be where the bearing has had additional clearance as a result of the groove in the bearing shell, no wearing into the crank journal.
Bearing shells are made from aluminium to be sacrificial, soft and cheap, these cranks are nitrided for extra hardness and expensive to re-work.
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After cleaning each bearing cap with a scouring pad I fitted all the bearing shells, tightened the main bearing caps to spec. then removed each one in turn to measure the clearance, re-tightening once measured.
To measure I removed the assembly lube and used engine oil as the lubricant, so as to not influence the measurement. After measuring I again cleaned the shell and re-applied assembly lube.
Assembly lube is more like liquid grease and has excellent cling ability, useful if the engine is going to be left standing before being run.

Clearances measured using plastigauge all came in around 60-65 microns (0.060 to 0.065mm)mm). Citroen don't give a clearance specification, but working it out from the sizes given it is:
Main bearing holder = 63.750mm
Crank journal diameter = 60mm
Bearing shell thickness = 1.842mm. (*2 to account for both walls)

Calc = 63.750 -60 -1.842 -1.842 =0.66mm (66 microns)
Working through the tolerances given in the Citroen technical information gives tolerances ranging from 41 microns to 85 microns (0.041-0.085mm)

Haynes manual states they didn't have Citroen figures at time of publication but suggest Big end and Main bearing clearances to be in the range 0.025-0.050mm. It appears the ATE diesel retained the larger Min bearing clearances of the earlier petrol engines.

The new Kolbenschmidt 77098608 bearings are nominally the same size as the original Citroen ones.

Nylon scouring pad/ Scotchbrite cleaning.
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To ensure you have all the bearings and caps the correct way round, all bearing locating tabs face the front of the car with the engine installed and all the Main bearing caps are numbered 1-5.
To use plastigauge clean the bearing shell and crank journal, cut (don't pinch off) a piece of plastigauge filament and lay it on the surface to be measured, apply a drop of oil as lube, then fit the bearing cap and tighten to spec.
Remove the bearing cap and measure how much the plastigauge has spread due to being crushed. The smaller the clearance, the more it will spread.

In these images the spread is slightly wider then 0.050 and narrower then 0.063, so about 0.060 (60 microns).
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Note #2 Main bearing has thrust bearing shims installed. These showed no wear at all.
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I then moved onto the crank pin journals, known as the Big ends. They are the big end of the connecting rod that connects the piston to the crank-shaft.
As these suffer more wear then main bearings I wanted to polish the crank journals, so used the wet n' dry paper and flat boot-lace method.
Cut w&d paper strips slightly narrower than the bearing shell and slightly longer than the circumference of the crank journal, lubricate (I soaked it in a tub of Atf), wrap it round the journal, wrap the boot-lace round a couple of turns, ensure the lace isn't twisted or tangled then pull on the laces to roll the paper round the journal.
After "polishing" clean the crank journals and flush out the oil drillings with solvent (brake cleaner), lubricate the new bearing shells with oil, install and tighten to spec, release the bearing cap, clean the shell, cut and fit a piece of plastigauge, a drop of oil again refit and tighten to spec.
Remove the cap and measure the clearance.

I found about 2 minutes polishing with lubricated 1200 grit w&d paper, followed by 1 minute with lubricated 2000 grit paper gave a satisfactory result.
I didn't want to remove much metal, just wanted a smooth, no rough particles, surface for bearing longevity. I could have polished to a finer degree but wasn't sure how quickly it would increase the bearing clearance, which I didn't want to do.
As it transpired I needn't have worried, these crank surfaces are very hard.

Lace wrap method.
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[

Before and after polishing. The left one is unpolished, the right one is. It appears slightly duller, but has no marks, or material deposits and is smoother overall.
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I was a bit concerned about what clearances I would see with the new bearing shell as the new Glyco 71-4279/4 STD are nominally slightly thicker than the Citroen original ones at 1.843mm as opposed to Citroen ones at 1.827mm.

Citroen specs are:
Big end holder = 53.695mm
Crank big end journal = 50mm
Bearing shells = 1.827mm
Citroen clearance = 53.695 -50 -1.827 -1.827 = 0.041mm

Glyco clearance = 53.695 -50 -1.843 -1.843 = 0.009mm, which is insufficient oil clearance.
Glyco give their operating clearance as 0.02 to 0.06mm.

I measured with plastigauge and found the filament less spread than the 0.025 size, so approx. 0.028 to 0.030mm. (28 to 30 microns) and in spec.
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I've so far only done #2 and 3 big end bearings, but will only report back if there is something of note with #3, or 4.
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92 2.1 sd M. 5685 ENT Blue Sideral
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