Some choice xm images....

[jorgy]

These are some nice photos too if u ask me...

black, a favorite

516_Citroen-XM-1989-1994-5-door-hatchback_2.jpg

1993 xm d12 black.jpg

and this one -don't the wheel trims here look much better than they look in reality?

516_Citroen-XM-1989-1994-5-door-hatchback_3.jpg

the US export version

citroen-xm-silver-l11 usa.jpg

and one for the road

s3000120.jpg

[CitroJim]

George, thanks for posting some very nice XM pictures. I really was getting tired of seeing that hideous new Pug thing in this thread..

I'm not a fan of modern car design at all. They all look like they need to visit the gym and a lot seem to have fussy, gaudy styling that reminds me of Dame Hilda Bracket's glasses. In fact the whole car reminds me of her...

Stylists seem to spend an inordinate time on lights these days and over-do it massively. Lights are functional devices and not style icons... They just need to look OK, not stand out and work as intended. On the XM they generally do - head lamps excepted

I like my cars slim, lithe and of clean line with no fussy details.

As the years go by the XM (and the Xantia) just looks better and better.

[casalingua]

I like the look of the car without the rear spoiler. Some early cars were sold without one of any type. I saw a V6 in Switzerland. No spoiler and no plugs on the rear deck. Does anyone know how much of a difference it makes to have no spoiler?

[captainhaddock]

I agree but they are getting better by age and that has something to say about the more modern cars on the road. Or the speed with which we adept to new styles and designs. Personally, I think I am very slow adepting:)
The XM never appealed to me before but now I think , compared to more modern stuff, she starts standing out. I find citroens must grow upon you first, sort of. Like the latest C5 for example, didn't like it at first but now, I think it's not too bad. Maybe in 10 years time I really start liking it?? LIke that Peu Jim mentions, it has a few nice touches and the rest is wrong. Same with a lot of modern cars including new Cit's.

[casalingua]

There are a few good bits of work and what they have in common is simplicity. The current crop of small and medium Kias and Hyundais are good and most of Audi´s output looks correct. I liked the XM from the day it came out. I remember seeing the press photos in Car in 1988 or early 89. I was intrigued. That summer in France I tried to time my appearance at the taxi rank so I could be driven in an XM. My trick failed and I was pipped at the post and got to try a R25 instead.

[captainhaddock]

I instantly liked the R25 (Opron) and didn't have that with at first the GS(A) (did own and loved them)
A nice black or blue R25 with hydraulics I'd even consider now...but my other half only started loving the GS after getting car sick in it .............................. the fist time she was driven in it Mind you, we drove that same car all the way to the Algarve at top speed and back with her behind the wheel and she loved it, still does now! THAT's the point I tried to make!
But now, I don't know. I'll try and stick with the XM for a while! We tried C3's and C4's and we did not like them really. Sorry for anyone driving them!

[russ92xmsed]

Lovely Pics there Jorgy. Seen those before and they do make the XM look very good indeed. Infact its these type of images that got me hooked on the car when it was brand new. I have always had a strong fascination with XM since I was about 8-9 years old. I just loved it and desperately wanted one. I wanted my Dad to get one....that never would have happened!
I totally agree with what you are all saying. Theres a pleasing simplicity of both the Xantia and XM which just doesn't seem to date. Every line seems well considered and adds to the overall design rather than being there simply because the designer wanted extra flimflam. Look at an Apple Iphone or Ipad...they are so simple in their aesthetics they simply wont date, yet look modern and fresh still.

I instantly liked the R25 (Opron) and didn't have that with at first the GS(A) (did own and loved them)
A nice black or blue R25 with hydraulics I'd even consider now...but my other half only started loving the GS after getting car sick in it .............................. the fist time she was driven in it Mind you, we drove that same car all the way to the Algarve at top speed and back with her behind the wheel and she loved it, still does now! THAT's the point I tried to make!
But now, I don't know. I'll try and stick with the XM for a while! We tried C3's and C4's and we did not like them really. Sorry for anyone driving them!

I also love the Renault 25 Jaap, and I have real soft spot for the mk1 Renault Safrane in Silver or dark blue...even if it is considered a bland car. Infact that period of car late 80's to early 90's ecxec cars are probably my favourite period of car at the moment. The current C5 I still think is a great design and totally overlooked which is a shame. I like the C4 but the C3 in reality is boring and just a car. I liked the C2, but wow was it badly built...very cheap plastics.

George, thanks for posting some very nice XM pictures. I really was getting tired of seeing that hideous new Pug thing in this thread..

I'm not a fan of modern car design at all. They all look like they need to visit the gym and a lot seem to have fussy, gaudy styling that reminds me of Dame Hilda Bracket's glasses. In fact the whole car reminds me of her...

Stylists seem to spend an inordinate time on lights these days and over-do it massively. Lights are functional devices and not style icons... They just need to look OK, not stand out and work as intended. On the XM they generally do - head lamps excepted

I like my cars slim, lithe and of clean line with no fussy details.

As the years go by the XM (and the Xantia) just looks better and better.

Typically the public are about 10 years behind designers. So it will take a while for strong designs to become embraced. I however think that gap is now reduced somewhat.
I find when I sit down and draw a car Jim, I always end up reflecting modern car design trends and that usually means a fussy design and elaborate headlights and detailing. I do think though some designs are very well considered and without certain lines or creases, they would look worse. But I do think Peugeots current crop of cars have been particularly bad. One design that I liked very much which I think was very clean design was the Renault Laguna coupe. Bung an ES9 V6 in it and your away. I would have one!
Anyway I'll post up my latest Pug design soon and you can all have a good laugh!!

[casalingua]

The Renault 25 is undeservedly overlooked. I drove one a few years back and I found it very agreeable. The starter motor was a bit noisy and the sill-height gave away the age of the architecture. But it would make a very good alterative to an XM, especially and probably only in Series 1 form. If you were a real individualist you could have the rare LWB version but try finding one. The last one I saw for sale was for €10,000, located in Luxembourg. Banker´s car, I would guess. And the Laguna coupe is one of the better looking recent offerings. CAR slammed it for the poor ride quality. Nobody from Renault ever came forward to explain. The Laguna hatch, on the other hand had nearly nothing going for it except it did have a rather Citroeny look about it.

[russ92xmsed]

Well here it is. It isn't perfect by any means and I would change probably most of it...including pushing the A pillar back and increasing the bonnet a little.
And to completely contradict myself by creating a fussy and over the top design, ......it does need to be calmed down and look less crude and aggressive. But it gives a flavour of how I imagine a large Peugeot should possible look. Might continue developing this!

[casalingua]

If I might make a suggestion: try removing as many creases and feature lines as possible and see what happens. Peugeot is, for me, about restrained design, as if stylists have smoothed a shape led by engineering. The important aspects of such cars relate to what I call undrawable design, the small-scale refinements and junctions of various parts. Something like an iPhone only makes sense as a very realistic prototype; a drawing shows nearly nothing as there is so little there. Many Mercedes of the classic era are not especially suited to design by drawing; it´s the way the window frames are handled and so on where the "design" character lives. But I should say it´s easier said than done. A Peugeot saloon in contempary style is a hard brief. Think of a French Audi and you might find something to draw on, as it were. It´s a nice image though and well done.